tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post8698057463475510157..comments2024-03-26T19:23:49.755-07:00Comments on Introibo Ad Altare Dei: Doubting Yourself---In The ExtremeIntroibo Ad Altare Deihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11377479441601352059noreply@blogger.comBlogger82125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-11501257003827889242022-01-05T05:31:56.814-08:002022-01-05T05:31:56.814-08:00People who don't under stand law, civil or ecc...People who don't under stand law, civil or ecclesiastical do not under stand the powerful meaning of presume. What it takes to overcome it either. That word is the crux of the validity here. This man has not overcame the presumption.SMockohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14652978008487543478noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-39637951774112495362021-01-28T08:48:06.371-08:002021-01-28T08:48:06.371-08:00Hi Peter, are you still in South Africa? I'm l...Hi Peter, are you still in South Africa? I'm looking for a Sede Priest here but I can't find any. RockChickAnahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08223027222073366764noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-66568974172077056092019-09-08T13:49:58.808-07:002019-09-08T13:49:58.808-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Gabrielhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15418017365454433678noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-2204459614411202042019-09-08T13:04:24.331-07:002019-09-08T13:04:24.331-07:00Gabriel,
I don’t have the necessary facts to draw ...Gabriel,<br />I don’t have the necessary facts to draw a conclusion. Old Catholic Orders are considered valid if the are received in certain European areas because the clergy is properly trained and they have carefully recorded episcopal lineages. The U.S. is not like that. Not knowing anything about his ordaining/consecrating bishop, I really cannot make an informed decision.<br /><br />—-Introibo Introibo Ad Altare Deihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11377479441601352059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-79598019940721297792019-09-08T12:23:53.322-07:002019-09-08T12:23:53.322-07:00I realize this discussion focuses on Lefevre and T...I realize this discussion focuses on Lefevre and Thuc orders, but please permit an inquiry regarding the opponent. Assuming you have relevant facts in evidence, do you have an opinion on the validity of Joseph's own consecration? (corrected) Gabrielhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15418017365454433678noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-29597553305058104242019-09-08T11:40:00.101-07:002019-09-08T11:40:00.101-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Gabrielhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15418017365454433678noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-40327675507496296622019-06-22T14:27:56.314-07:002019-06-22T14:27:56.314-07:00See my post http://introiboadaltaredei2.blogspot.c...See my post http://introiboadaltaredei2.blogspot.com/2016/07/the-church-can-supply-jurisdiction-but.html?m=1<br /><br />—-Introibo Introibo Ad Altare Deihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11377479441601352059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-41618944355726374902019-06-22T14:27:22.782-07:002019-06-22T14:27:22.782-07:00See my post
http://introiboadaltaredei2.blogspot.c...See my post<br />http://introiboadaltaredei2.blogspot.com/2016/07/the-church-can-supply-jurisdiction-but.html?m=1<br /><br />—-Introibo Introibo Ad Altare Deihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11377479441601352059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-81658779192137864372019-06-22T01:45:29.092-07:002019-06-22T01:45:29.092-07:00Glory to Jesus and Honour to Mary,
I have followe...Glory to Jesus and Honour to Mary,<br /><br />I have followed your exchange with 'bishop' Josephmarie on the issue of the validity of Lefevbre Ordination and of the clergy emanating from him.Very interesting insights.<br /><br />What do you hold of the position of the Home-aloners who say and teach that Catholics should not attend the masses and receive sacraments from today's traditional catholic clergy on account of their possessing no jurisdiction even if we concede that their ordinations are valid.The arguments expounded in the following articles seem very convincing and airtight.Could you please analysis and refute if possible.<br />Thanks for the anticipated response you may find time to make.<br />The posts among others are the following:<br /><br />https://www.betrayedcatholics.com/free-content/reference-links/3-the-latin-mass/jurisdiction-lawful-pastors-and-communicatio-in-sacris/<br /><br /><br />and this also<br /><br />https://www.betrayedcatholics.com/free-content/reference-links/6-traditionalists/why-traditionalist-clerics-never-received-valid-orders/<br /><br />Thank you for your time and God bless<br /><br />Francis<br />Francishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11731345389611701460noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-18810263910790807202019-06-22T00:58:36.897-07:002019-06-22T00:58:36.897-07:00Thank you for the works you do to try to throw lig...Thank you for the works you do to try to throw light on the issue of the validity of traditionalist clergy and their sacraments.I have read your arguments against 'bishop' Josephmarie on the validity of Lefebvre priests and I am weighing their merits pros and cons.For an exhaustive treatment on these burning issues I will appreciate if you could refute the claims and the position of the Home-aloners who maintain that true Catholics today cannot attend the masses of the various traditional clergy groups we have around due mainly to the loss of jurisdiction and validity of ordination.<br /><br />Specifically you may want to pls refute the following posts which seem very cogent to me as a layman:<br /><br /> https://www.betrayedcatholics.com/free-content/reference-links/3-the-latin-mass/jurisdiction-lawful-pastors-and-communicatio-in-sacris/<br /><br />and again<br /><br />https://www.betrayedcatholics.com/free-content/reference-links/6-traditionalists/why-traditionalist-clerics-never-received-valid-orders/<br /><br />I look forward to reading a convincing rebuttal from you on why the above arguments don't hold water<br /><br />Best wishes and thanks for your time<br /><br />FrankFrancishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11731345389611701460noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-65182555026614106562018-09-20T08:16:34.346-07:002018-09-20T08:16:34.346-07:00See my rebuttal post:
http://introiboadaltaredei2...See my rebuttal post:<br /><br />http://introiboadaltaredei2.blogspot.com/2016/08/sophistry-on-steroids.html?m=1<br /><br />God Bless,<br /><br />—-Introibo Introibo Ad Altare Deihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11377479441601352059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-87576743422534216152018-09-19T23:42:13.087-07:002018-09-19T23:42:13.087-07:00http://bishopjosephmarie.org/doctrine/introibo.htm...http://bishopjosephmarie.org/doctrine/introibo.html <br /><br />Kindly respond to above. Thanks Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-14438547753737044882018-05-31T17:11:52.427-07:002018-05-31T17:11:52.427-07:00Glad you found a holy bishop to guide you!
God Bl...Glad you found a holy bishop to guide you!<br /><br />God Bless,<br /><br />---IntroiboIntroibo Ad Altare Deihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11377479441601352059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-78892905937054391522018-05-31T17:06:27.610-07:002018-05-31T17:06:27.610-07:00Glad you found a holy bishop to guide you!
God Bl...Glad you found a holy bishop to guide you!<br /><br />God Bless,<br /><br />---IntroiboIntroibo Ad Altare Deihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11377479441601352059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-5988835381464408812018-05-31T16:34:27.950-07:002018-05-31T16:34:27.950-07:00Thanks for your perseverance with the contentious,...Thanks for your perseverance with the contentious, IAD. It really cleared a lot up. However, I must admit there seem to be many naughty swdevacantist bishops, some of which have lied, deceived, and swindled, and scandalized many. Sometimes I wonder if some of,these men want to destroy from within or if they simply have IMMENSE egos. I pray for their immortal souls, but I do thank God every day that I have met one good bishop who,has shown Christlike devotion to my family's souls. Ps I don't work for the daily Catholic. I,just,like the site.Michael Archangelhttp://dailycatholic.orgnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-57603733777722682022018-05-28T22:04:19.919-07:002018-05-28T22:04:19.919-07:00You are mistaken on several counts but two are the...You are mistaken on several counts but two are the most important. <br /><br />1. Canon Law contains prescriptions of both Divine Law (e.g. water must be used for Baptism), and Ecclesiastical Law (e.g. fasting regulations). You think all of them are immutable, but this is false.<br />Ecclesiastical Law such as needing papal approval to consecrate bishops Ceases automatically and positively when it becomes harmful (nociva) to observe. For this, see the works by moral theologians and canonists Abbo-Hannon, Aertnys-Damen, Badii, Beste, Cappello, Cicognani, Cocchi, Coronata, Maroto, McHugh-Callan, Merkelbach, Michels, Noldin, Regatillo-Zalba, Vermeersch, Wernz-Vidal, etc. <br /><br />In order for the Church to operate, bishops must be made, and the duty to administer the Sacraments is of Divine Law which supersedes Ecclesiastical Law. <br /><br />2. Without a pope the Church still functions albeit in a different manner. <br />According to theologian Dorsch, "The Church therefore is a society that is essentially monarchical. But this does not prevent the Church, for a short time after the death of a pope, OR EVEN FOR MANY YEARS, from remaining deprived of her head. [vel etiam per plures annos capite suo destituta manet]. Her monarchical form also remains intact in this state.…<br />Thus the Church is then indeed a headless body.… Her monarchical form of government remains, though then in a different way — that is, it remains incomplete and to be completed. The ordering of the whole to submission to her Primate is present, even though actual submission is not…<br /><br />For this reason, the See of Rome is rightly said to remain after the person sitting in it has died — for the See of Rome consists essentially in the rights of the Primate.<br /><br />These rights are an essential and necessary element of the Church. With them, moreover, the Primacy then continues, at least morally. The perennial physical presence of the person of the head, however, [perennitas autem physica personis principis] is not so strictly necessary." (de Ecclesia 2:196–7)<br /><br /> Second, according to theologian Salaverri, instead of being a "primary foundation… without which the Church could not exist," the pope is a "secondary foundation," "ministerial," who exercises his power as someone else’s (Christ’s) representative. (See De Ecclesia 1:448)<br /><br />The Church in Japan was different insofar as the problem was contained in that country and not a worldwide Apostasy.<br /><br />The private revelations of saints are not of the Deposit of Faith, and no Catholic is bound to believe in them.<br /><br />There was no excuse for Abp Thuc ordaining and consecrating the unfit, be he, like you, fell victim to a private revelation proven false. That doesn’t make his other ordinations and consecrations wrong or invalid.<br /><br />—-Introibo <br />Introibo Ad Altare Deihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11377479441601352059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-31026392858709177512018-05-28T21:35:12.449-07:002018-05-28T21:35:12.449-07:00Intoibo Ad Altare Dei,
Your phony bishops have br...Intoibo Ad Altare Dei,<br /><br />Your phony bishops have broken all the canon laws regarding consecration of bishops. As per the 1917 Canon code of law, the right of consecration of bishops belong only to the Roman Pontiff, moreover they have to be priests for three years before they can become bishops, plus they have to have a decree in canon law approved by the Holy See and they cannot function as a bishop unless they are assigned a diocese. Bishop Thuc has deliberately ignore these canon laws for simony. He has has ordained priest within days and make them bishops in a month or less leading to more soul being misled. A good example of that is the heretical Palmarian church which has led and is still leading souls to hell. There are many canon laws violated , as who can be a candidate for priesthood. You bring theologians etc., but canon law is very clear and theologians are not above the Roman Pontiff or canon laws! The Holy Catholic Church is not a headless church where one can just set churches, make bishops like a fair, She is wise and holy and has Her guidelines. We are not a headless church that can operate without the pope. Those who pretend to perpetuate the mass are ignoring the crisis foretold by many saints and are putting the faithful in a false sense of security. To say that excommunicated freemasons can continue to ordain, consecrate is anti-Catholic! Excommunicated priests, bishops cannot even consecrate the host or participate in the divine office until they reject their errors and reconcile with the Church! These are not my personal opinion, but canon law! The faithful sin when they receive communion from excommunicated priests and bishops. Only in imminent danger of death with no good priest around, can the faithful have recourse to them for the sacrament of confession and extreme unction. Please for the sake of your own soul, quit misguiding souls when you have no authority in the Church. You are in a false sense of security thinking you are attending mass, when you are not getting any sacramental graces. Moreover you are ignoring the imminent dangers of the time we live by preaching so. When " la petite Eglise " in France though Pope Leo XIII was dubbed and an antipope was in place, because he allowed Catholics to join the republic, despite believing so for years, having priests and valid bishops with them, they never consecrated bishops or ordained new priests while they thought the Holy See was vacant. This because they were more respectful of church law and they knew better that one cannot continue the visible church without a pope. The Japanese and the Hawaiians didn't have priest for 100 years or so and they survived by the grace of God and waited patiently for Him to act. You can't change or fight what God has allowed or planned Himself. We are in the great apostasy and might possibly going to the time of the antichrist, but there false theologians and false priests, bishops are dividing the faithful, lullabying them in false hopes and delusion. You can ignore approved prophecies of many saints about our times. Many saints never mentioned of phony groups continuing the priesthood. So is it ok for the false priests and bishops to violate canon laws, while proclaiming that they are defending the Catholic faith? Or ignoring the importance and function of a pope? Veritas2018https://www.blogger.com/profile/03465890740563246150noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-37622915042573661372017-12-10T15:18:18.083-08:002017-12-10T15:18:18.083-08:00See thucbishops.com. If it's not there, I'...See thucbishops.com. If it's not there, I'll be doing a post on that nonsense early next year.<br /><br />---IntroiboIntroibo Ad Altare Deihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11377479441601352059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-9862490462298713442017-12-10T10:26:02.870-08:002017-12-10T10:26:02.870-08:00Prove it then.
Prove it then. <br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-27435300690866934922017-12-09T17:59:26.941-08:002017-12-09T17:59:26.941-08:00Not true.
—-Introibo Not true. <br /><br />—-Introibo Introibo Ad Altare Deihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11377479441601352059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-56897566815846680472017-12-09T17:41:43.049-08:002017-12-09T17:41:43.049-08:00There is no record of Thuc's abjuration, only ...There is no record of Thuc's abjuration, only a declaration without an abjuration.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-57720646551524357162017-12-09T17:29:03.755-08:002017-12-09T17:29:03.755-08:00Even if the bishop abjures? Not true.
—-Introibo ...Even if the bishop abjures? Not true.<br /><br />—-Introibo Introibo Ad Altare Deihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11377479441601352059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-39778001923943146582017-12-09T17:23:48.913-08:002017-12-09T17:23:48.913-08:00I disagree with him on some things, but his brief ...I disagree with him on some things, but his brief against the thucites was astoundingly good. Bishop Thuc supported VII, and Catholics cannot legally receive Orders from notorious apostate, heretic, or schismatic bishops. <br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-60895187629434085532017-12-07T17:52:38.752-08:002017-12-07T17:52:38.752-08:00LOL! “Soundly refuted”? Richard Ibranyi is a theol...LOL! “Soundly refuted”? Richard Ibranyi is a theological illiterate and leader of a whacky cult in New Mexico which believes there has been no pope since 1130 A.D. He is in desperate need of our prayers and psychological help.<br /><br />—-Introibo Introibo Ad Altare Deihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11377479441601352059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6466183320330735196.post-42726033742639278482017-12-07T17:24:07.727-08:002017-12-07T17:24:07.727-08:00The Christian community are those Faithful Catholi...The Christian community are those Faithful Catholics who stay true to what was always taught before we lost the Papacy in 1951. Since there are no Clergy with jurisdiction, Sedevacantist groups are illegal, and rooted in canonical crimes. Faith before the Mass! <br /><br />Thucbishops.com is riddled with errors. He was soundly refuted in "Against the Thucites<br />Bishop Ngô Thuc’s Heretical and Illegal Linage" by Richard Ibranyi. <br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com